DELPHI, Ind — 13News has obtained explosive new documents that details exactly what was said in closed chambers before a recent hearing in the Delphi murders case.
A 29-page transcript shows what Judge Frances Gull said to Richard Allen’s original defense team before she disqualified them from the case. Allen is accused of killing Libby German and Abby Williams in Delphi, Indiana in 2017.
In it, Allen's attorneys are discussing their concerns over the judge's used of the word "disqualification" after learning of a leak of evidence from attorney Andrew Baldwin's office. That leak concerned a friend and former employee of Baldwin had photographed crime scene evidence in Baldwin's office and then released it without consent.
Prosecutor Nicholoas McLeland told the judge he was prepared to share the status of the investigation into the leak. McLeland said he had witnesses and exhibits ready to present. He also voiced his frustration about the leak stating, "I'm concerned that the leak is not just a one-time leak. The evidence that we have shows it is an ongoing leak, however it's being done, and it's just – what's next?"
Allen's then-attorney, Bradley Rozzi, tries to establish he had nothing to do with the leak of evidence from Baldwin's office.
"And I'm not distancing myself from Mr. Baldwin, I'm just saying I have no connection with any of these people," Rozzi said, referring to those involved in the leak.
Rozzi then goes on to tell the judge there has been leaks on the case from the beginning and he doesn't see this leak as impacting the case.
Both Rozzi and Baldwin ask the judge to discuss the matter at a future point when they can prepare to defend themselves.
The judge told attorneys Brad Rozzi and Andrew Baldwin, “…it pains me to say this, but the totality of these circumstances demonstrate gross negligence and incompetence on the part of the defense team. I am unsatisfied with your representation of Mr. Allen. am gravely concerned about his rights to have competent, non-negligent representation. He currently doesn't have that right now, because what you have demonstrated is negligence and incompetence. Now, I am sharing my thoughts with you privately. don't want to say this in open court. would encourage you to talk privately about what you wish to do. don't want this coming out, it is not where we need to be with this case, but will... I am finding gross incompetence and negligence with you.”
RELATED: Inmate claims abuse, intimidation by prison staff watching Delphi murders suspect Richard Allen
The judge was referring to evidence leaks traced to the staff of Baldwin and court filings that the defense team filed without requesting to place them under seal despite containing sensitive information.
The judge then encourages Allen's attorneys to have a private conversation among themselves and talk with their client.
Rozzi then responds, "I mean, obviously reading the tea leaves here, what you're giving us a chance to do is bow out gracefully, if you will, if that's the right term."
Rozzi expresses concern that new counsel for Allen could delay the trial by a year and so, keeping Allen from his right to a speedy trial.
Rozzi then asks for clarification on what the judge intends to do, that she plans to remove them from the case. She responds, "I will, based on what I've just shared with you."
The two attorneys ask to have a moment that they can discuss the issue privately and with Allen. When they return, they communicate that Allen does not want them to withdraw from the case. Rozzi then tells the judge he plans to file a motion to withdraw from the case. "I don't want to do it, but I don't think that I have a choice at this point," Rozzi said. "The options I've been given without any notice by the Court really are either I withdraw or I'm gonna be publicly shamed and that's the way I see this." Rozzi expresses that it feels like a "forced resignation" but he feels like he has been given no other choice professionally.
The attorneys said there is a process for a formal disciplinary claim and that didn't happen and they were not given the opportunity to properly prepare.
"I also have some common sense and, you know, me going in there and standing my ground because my client wants me to is just gonna make things worse for him, and so I'm gonna withdraw my appearance," Rozzi goes on to say. Rozzi goes on to state that he feels they were not given proper opportunity to defend themselves.
The judge responded, " Well, I think we talked about. when you asked for a disqualification, and I indicated on our phone conversation I'm inclined to do that."
Rozzi responds, saying in part, "I've seen lawyers disqualified and there is a process for that and it's not this."
Baldwin then says he echoes what Rozzi said and that he will also withdraw. "I'm stunned, I don't know what to say, so I'll just say I'm moving to withdraw orally."
Since that hearing, the judge has appointed new counsel to represent Allen.
Both Baldwin and Rozzi later tried to stay on the case, even offering to help pro bono for Allen's new attorneys, but the judge denied them.
Civil attorneys have questioned the judge's actions and taken the issue to the Indiana Supreme Court, which will be considering those filings.
Leak of evidence
In the filing to the Indiana Supreme Court, Allen's attorneys claim he was made aware that a friend and former employee of attorney Andrew Baldwin had photographed crime scene evidence in Baldwin's office and then released it without consent.
A letter from Allen's attorney, Bradley Rozzi, informed the judge to the theft on Oct. 6. Judge Gull responded, saying in part, "Thank you for passing on this troubling information."
Prosecutor Nicholoas McLeland then emails the judge and Allen's attorneys that the incident was investigated by Indiana State Police and that several people were identified. The first being the friend and former employee who had photographed the evidence and the others who had disseminated it. One of those allegedly involved would take their own life.
The judge then responded to that news saying, "I'm deeply concerned that Mr. Allen's defense is being compromised by all these recent events and set an Oct. 19 hearing.” She then ordered the original defense team to stop working on the case.
Documents filed Monday with the Supreme Court include an Oct. 11 letter from Allen to the judge in which Allen said he had been made aware of the evidence leak and still wanted to keep Baldwin and Rozzi as his defense attorneys.
Before that hearing, the filing includes an Oct. 11 letter purportedly from Allen to the judge in which he claims he was made aware of the theft and still wanted to keep Baldwin and Bradley Rozzi as his attorneys.
However, at a hearing on Oct. 19, the judge said she accepted Baldwin's verbal withdrawal from the case that day and that she expected Rozzi to submit a written withdrawal in the next few days. His attorneys later claimed Judge Frances Gull forced their withdrawal.
According to a later court filing from Rozzi, the defense and prosecutor met with Judge Gull prior to the Oct. 19 hearing when the judge read a prepared statement to Rozzi and Baldwin, identifying various issues throughout the case of the defense exercising "gross negligence" in carrying out their responsibilities for Allen.
In his filing, Rozzi then says says the judge then gave Rozzi and Baldwin two options:
- Voluntarily withdraw their appearances and exit the courthouse in advance of the hearing
- Participate in the 2 p.m. hearing, and the judge would read a prepared statement into the record and then disqualify both Rozzi and Baldwin in the presence of Allen, his family and the public.
According to the filing, the defense then spoke with Allen, who allegedly reaffirmed he wanted to continue being represented by Rozzi and Baldwin — and Allen allegedly still objects to the judge taking Baldwin and Rozzi off the case.
In court filing, Rozzi said the judge "had engaged in an ambush of defense counsel, entirely void of due process." Rozzi said he agreed to withdraw his appearance but says he was coerced and did not do it voluntarily.
An order by Gull was entered into record Oct. 19 — after the hearing — in which she ordered Rozzi and Baldwin withdrawn from the case. She then ordered the clerk to remove them as attorneys of record in the case. Subsequent filings by Rozzi were then ordered removed from court record by the judge.
Rozzi is also requesting Gull remove herself from the case. The attorney is asking for her recusal, claiming she has shown her "impartiality might reasonably be questioned."
Rozzi goes on to claim Gull violated the Indiana Supreme Court’s Administrative Rules by removing or concealing some of the defense’s pleadings from the case summary.